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Lisztomania 69M
13711 posts
12/7/2018 10:41 am
GHW BUSH ENTERS INTO EPISCOPAL VALHALLA


On Wednesday a little before 11:00 , I sank into the couch to watch a bit of the elder Bush's funeral at the National Cathedral. As I have the attention span of a tse-tse fly (unless listening to Wagnerian opera), I didn't expect to stay the course to the end.

Two and a half hours later, I was still riveted in place as the president's body was being borne out of the church. It was the most overwhelming spiritual experience I have had in quite some time. It was a synaesthetic experience: the pageantry of the High Church Episcopalian service, the colors of the vestments and banners, the sublimity of the music, the beautiful texts and words from the eulogists and the ancient texts of the liturgy, the sincerity of the mourners combined to fill a void in the soul. It was hard not to think well of one's fellow men afterwards.

I have spent a good deal of my life moonlighting as an Episcopal church musician, and so I was fascinated to follow this aspect of the service. Having played for many high feast occasions, I can pass this on: the organist is the quarterback of the service, not any of the gaggle of clergymen. The hymnody -- what the people collectively sing -- is the "theology of the people." The hymns, some of which were Bush's favorites, reflected the man: they were great hymns of praise, not of lamentation. They were also extremely Episcopalian hymns: "Praise the Lord, the King of Heaven," "For all the saints, who from their labors rest" -- splendid hymns which invite the organist to drop the hammer. There were also great hymns known to all Protestants: "A Mighty Fortress is our God" (composed by Martin Luther himself), "Fairest Lord Jesus," "Oh God, our help in ages past," and many others.

The eulogists surpassed themselves. Bush's biographer Jon Meacham had been given unparalleled access to the Bush family, and spoke with affection and an insider's knowledge of his subject. Brian Mulroney, at age 79, gave a little gem of a eulogy in his very pleasant basso. Thank you, Canada! He was gracious enough to say the following: "this country, the United States, which is, in my judgment, the greatest democratic republic that God has ever placed on the face of this earth." What do you think, Lulu? Then finally George W Bush outdid himself. Never considered eloquent, he rose to this occasion, though overcome by grief at the end.

The whole ceremony was like a refreshing drink for a parched nation. The effect may be short-lived, but we demonstrated our better selves, and gave us hope that we have not strayed too far off course to become once again a more civil nation.


Lisztomania 69M
10497 posts
12/7/2018 10:45 am

Some footnotes will follow later in the day.


starwomyn 66F
6721 posts
12/7/2018 11:57 am

I have watched it on and off. It was definitely classy and moving.


bijou649 70F
701 posts
12/7/2018 1:15 pm

I never thought I would sit day after day watching Christian funerals, let alone the long drawn out State Funerals of McCain or Bush Sr., but somehow I did. Both those men served their country and lived their lives with honour and dignity, and both seem to have been so loved by their family and friends. I was wondering who pays for all these week long funerals which involve multiple venues, orchestras, choirs, limos, planes, and trains to basically drag the deceased all over the place?


Unsafe_Sax_54 65M
1452 posts
12/7/2018 1:18 pm

GHWB was a standout on my political timeline. He wasn't Ronnie, but he sure as HELL wasn't a Clinton.

What a different world we'd be in if he had had 2 terms and the Clintons had had none.


MrsJoe 72F
11476 posts
12/7/2018 2:15 pm

I watched a bit of it, and saw when they lifted the casket out of the hearse with the family watching. I was glad they didn't focus too much on the family at that time. It was a touching moment for them, and the nation did not need to "read" the expressions on their faces.

If you expect nothing from anyone, you won't be disappointed, but you might be pleasantly surprised.


Skariff2 66M
2901 posts
12/7/2018 2:48 pm

Your observations are accurate as well as eloquent. More importantly, however, was the hope behind the words. The idea we could return to those thrilling days of yesteryear when we were a nation with that "all for one, one for all" attitude brings excitement to those of us who realize that possibility actually exists. The naysayers who have posted here remind us the path to Valhalla is arduous.

Prejudice cannot be conquered with logic, logic didn't instill it and logic cannot eradicate it.


Lisztomania 69M
10497 posts
12/7/2018 4:25 pm

    Quoting bijou649:
    I never thought I would sit day after day watching Christian funerals, let alone the long drawn out State Funerals of McCain or Bush Sr., but somehow I did. Both those men served their country and lived their lives with honour and dignity, and both seem to have been so loved by their family and friends. I was wondering who pays for all these week long funerals which involve multiple venues, orchestras, choirs, limos, planes, and trains to basically drag the deceased all over the place?
I'm sure the government picks up the tab. But I, as a taxpayer, think it's worth it and do not begrudge it. I doubt if Queen Elizabeth II will pay for her funeral either.


Lisztomania 69M
10497 posts
12/7/2018 4:30 pm

    Quoting Unsafe_Sax_54:
    GHWB was a standout on my political timeline. He wasn't Ronnie, but he sure as HELL wasn't a Clinton.

    What a different world we'd be in if he had had 2 terms and the Clintons had had none.
I think GHW's defeat in 1992 was the most disappointed I have been after a presidential election. We traded down in that election and are still suffering the consequences.


Lisztomania 69M
10497 posts
12/7/2018 4:40 pm

Personal note: Usually when there is a big conflab of Episcopalians, I know some of them, as I taught at a college owned by the Episcopal Church, and lived (and still own) in a house across the street from the School of Theology. I didn't recognize any of the clergy, but I do know Jon Meacham, the first eulogist. He is in fact my neighbor in the afore-mentioned college town. I marvel at Meacham's poise and style.


Lisztomania 69M
10497 posts
12/7/2018 4:42 pm

    Quoting Skariff2:
    Your observations are accurate as well as eloquent. More importantly, however, was the hope behind the words. The idea we could return to those thrilling days of yesteryear when we were a nation with that "all for one, one for all" attitude brings excitement to those of us who realize that possibility actually exists. The naysayers who have posted here remind us the path to Valhalla is arduous.
Thanks for the kind words!


hiramhankwilliam 96M
4480 posts
12/7/2018 8:04 pm

    Quoting Lisztomania:
    I think GHW's defeat in 1992 was the most disappointed I have been after a presidential election. We traded down in that election and are still suffering the consequences.
lisz,

you always do a great job with your blogs.

I wish I had your wring skills. I possess a lot of thoughts etc but fail to put them down in print.

we share some thing.

I have no attention span.

a I write this I have 4 projects going on and who knows how many needs to be.

I am writing the rest here slowly as not to offend you or sax..

ghw, caused his defeat. he lacked patience.

he abandoned Reagans success with the economy.

I do agree he would have been light years better than slick.

I recall the town hall debate pitting him against slick and ross piro.

the camera focued on him many times sitting on a stoll figeding an staring at his watch.

i also recall the nixon jfk debate. nixon had dark shadow beard.

my point in both is public perception.

bush looked bored and impatience. how much that affected voters. no way to know. it beckons the same question about how nixon looked, versus jfk.

nixon looked like he had not slept in week, jfk was smooth and cool. his looks garnered him a much better public visual.

it has been said that folk listing on radio thought nixon won.

i often wonder how different thing would have been had nixon won. same as i wonder how different thing would have been had jfk not died.

one last thing.

as a fellow student on the jfk coup d'état. yes it was an over throw,cia led,

do some searched about the formation of the cia. there are names that will ring familar.

mid 50s an on,ghw's name appears on a regular pattern. oops i meant to say connected to the cia which was set up by among others prescott bush.

utube has a reasure trove of vids on the cia's connection to jfk .

it shows many documents with ghw's name connectd to the investigation of jfk's death.

google ,Dark Alliance: The CIA, the Contras, and the Crack Cocaine Explosion is a 1998 book by journalist Gary Webb.

read what mr webb learned. oh yes he committed suicide . he shot him self int eh head 2times.

ghw's name comes up as a key player in the movement of cociane out of parts of central america into calif. which fostered the crack cocaine plague

i do not reach a conclusion on purpose.

all this casts a dark shadow on the rep of 41.

DEATH IS A CERTAIN, ETERNITY IS A CHOICE


hiramhankwilliam 96M
4480 posts
12/7/2018 8:31 pm

lisz

very sorry to be long in the tooth. I hope it comes out making sense.

I was and confused .

seems he lead 2 lives

DEATH IS A CERTAIN, ETERNITY IS A CHOICE


Lisztomania 69M
10497 posts
12/8/2018 7:13 am

    Quoting hiramhankwilliam:
    lisz,

    you always do a great job with your blogs.

    I wish I had your wring skills. I possess a lot of thoughts etc but fail to put them down in print.

    we share some thing.

    I have no attention span.

    a I write this I have 4 projects going on and who knows how many needs to be.

    I am writing the rest here slowly as not to offend you or sax..

    ghw, caused his defeat. he lacked patience.

    he abandoned Reagans success with the economy.

    I do agree he would have been light years better than slick.

    I recall the town hall debate pitting him against slick and ross piro.

    the camera focued on him many times sitting on a stoll figeding an staring at his watch.

    i also recall the nixon jfk debate. nixon had dark shadow beard.

    my point in both is public perception.

    bush looked bored and impatience. how much that affected voters. no way to know. it beckons the same question about how nixon looked, versus jfk.

    nixon looked like he had not slept in week, jfk was smooth and cool. his looks garnered him a much better public visual.

    it has been said that folk listing on radio thought nixon won.

    i often wonder how different thing would have been had nixon won. same as i wonder how different thing would have been had jfk not died.

    one last thing.

    as a fellow student on the jfk coup d'état. yes it was an over throw,cia led,

    do some searched about the formation of the cia. there are names that will ring familar.

    mid 50s an on,ghw's name appears on a regular pattern. oops i meant to say connected to the cia which was set up by among others prescott bush.

    utube has a reasure trove of vids on the cia's connection to jfk .

    it shows many documents with ghw's name connectd to the investigation of jfk's death.

    google ,Dark Alliance: The CIA, the Contras, and the Crack Cocaine Explosion is a 1998 book by journalist Gary Webb.

    read what mr webb learned. oh yes he committed suicide . he shot him self int eh head 2times.

    ghw's name comes up as a key player in the movement of cociane out of parts of central america into calif. which fostered the crack cocaine plague

    i do not reach a conclusion on purpose.

    all this casts a dark shadow on the rep of 41.
I appreciate your thoughts, Hank. As you know, I try to keep up with JFK assassination research, and a number of outliers among the researchers are pushing the line that GHWB was somehow involved with the assassination. My instinct is to reject this, not just because of Bush's known character, but also because of the flimsiness of the evidence. A person who somewhat resembles Bush appears in a photograph of the crowd at Dealey Plaza minutes after the shooting. To my eye, it simply isn't Bush. Others have chosen to see George W. (age 16) also in the crowd. The theory is that as Bush was CIA director years afterward, he must have been working for them all along.

It certainly is true that the CIA recruited heavily in the Ivies, especially Yale and the Skull & Bones Society. But it's a huge leap from there to GHWB supervising a hit team in a broom closet in the Dal-Tex Building on Nov. 22.

Some have suggested that the government has been withholding certain files incriminating Poppy until after his death. Now's the time to put up or shut up.


Lisztomania 69M
10497 posts
12/8/2018 7:22 am

    Quoting hiramhankwilliam:
    lisz,

    you always do a great job with your blogs.

    I wish I had your wring skills. I possess a lot of thoughts etc but fail to put them down in print.

    we share some thing.

    I have no attention span.

    a I write this I have 4 projects going on and who knows how many needs to be.

    I am writing the rest here slowly as not to offend you or sax..

    ghw, caused his defeat. he lacked patience.

    he abandoned Reagans success with the economy.

    I do agree he would have been light years better than slick.

    I recall the town hall debate pitting him against slick and ross piro.

    the camera focued on him many times sitting on a stoll figeding an staring at his watch.

    i also recall the nixon jfk debate. nixon had dark shadow beard.

    my point in both is public perception.

    bush looked bored and impatience. how much that affected voters. no way to know. it beckons the same question about how nixon looked, versus jfk.

    nixon looked like he had not slept in week, jfk was smooth and cool. his looks garnered him a much better public visual.

    it has been said that folk listing on radio thought nixon won.

    i often wonder how different thing would have been had nixon won. same as i wonder how different thing would have been had jfk not died.

    one last thing.

    as a fellow student on the jfk coup d'état. yes it was an over throw,cia led,

    do some searched about the formation of the cia. there are names that will ring familar.

    mid 50s an on,ghw's name appears on a regular pattern. oops i meant to say connected to the cia which was set up by among others prescott bush.

    utube has a reasure trove of vids on the cia's connection to jfk .

    it shows many documents with ghw's name connectd to the investigation of jfk's death.

    google ,Dark Alliance: The CIA, the Contras, and the Crack Cocaine Explosion is a 1998 book by journalist Gary Webb.

    read what mr webb learned. oh yes he committed suicide . he shot him self int eh head 2times.

    ghw's name comes up as a key player in the movement of cociane out of parts of central america into calif. which fostered the crack cocaine plague

    i do not reach a conclusion on purpose.

    all this casts a dark shadow on the rep of 41.
I agree with you that Bush was not as natural a politician as Reagan or Bill Clinton. He wasn't good at marketing himself and being a back-slapping regular guy. This was partially because of his patrician upbringing, which forbade ostentation and bragging. Trump does not have this problem.


kneedtwoplease 64M
1084 posts
12/8/2018 2:38 pm

Thank You for this post. It sent me into a search of other great Hymn favorites as well. I also appreciate your accomplishment as professional musician, even though I have no direct knowledge or experience of your expertise. Your mature and knowledgeable writing contrast the other noise which pathetically snivel to seize attention. As an aside, many lives were indeed saved by tail gunners. Whoever the one intent in using such as insult has indeed identified as a sort of tail himself, an ass.

Before Dan sees it... "I heard today the inventor of 'spell check' died, may he rust in piss"

MC & HNY. tim


bijou649 70F
701 posts
12/9/2018 6:51 am

    Quoting Lisztomania:
    I'm sure the government picks up the tab. But I, as a taxpayer, think it's worth it and do not begrudge it. I doubt if Queen Elizabeth II will pay for her funeral either.
If you feel like reading something I thought was very interesting, check out "U.S. State Funerals" in Wikipedia. It tells you all kinds of fascinating facts about previous presidents, how they died, what kind of funerals they had. One president (forgot which one) was only in office for one month before he died. When one president died (I think it was Kennedy) he said he wanted a funeral like Abraham Lincoln had. That was before the internet so his staff was hurriedly reading old magazines to try to find out about Lincoln's funeral.


Lisztomania 69M
10497 posts
12/9/2018 8:08 pm

    Quoting kneedtwoplease:
    Thank You for this post. It sent me into a search of other great Hymn favorites as well. I also appreciate your accomplishment as professional musician, even though I have no direct knowledge or experience of your expertise. Your mature and knowledgeable writing contrast the other noise which pathetically snivel to seize attention. As an aside, many lives were indeed saved by tail gunners. Whoever the one intent in using such as insult has indeed identified as a sort of tail himself, an ass.

    Before Dan sees it... "I heard today the inventor of 'spell check' died, may he rust in piss"

    MC & HNY. tim
Thanks for the kind words! It was Tex who dubbed me the tail gunner, and I think the idea was to suggest that I was subordinate to my wife. We have lots of insecure people on this site.