Close Please enter your Username and Password


GavinLS2 69M
936 posts
4/22/2019 9:02 pm
What I can't see.


Hi folks

Just had a thought that inspired me, and I feel like expressing it. It is said that God can't exist because we can't see Him.

So my question is: Does love exist?

GBU all,

Gavin


GavinLS2 69M
1525 posts
4/22/2019 9:03 pm


MrsJoe 76F
17367 posts
4/22/2019 10:11 pm

Or what about air?

Be a prism, spreading God's light and love, not a mirror reflecting the world's hatred.


Katie_au_lait 78F
7026 posts
4/23/2019 1:52 am

    Quoting MrsJoe:
    Or what about air?
Air is largely invisible, since it is composed of molecules, oxygen, nitrogen, carbon dioxide, argon and water vapor when it is moving it has momentum and you feel the momentum transfer when it hits you in the form of a breeze. If you have a device that converts that force to a physical variable: a near frictionless fan, or a very light flap, or a windsock then you can measure the moving air with an observable variable.

What is very observable, is that without air, nothing can live. That's an incontrovertable fact.


Archer62 83F
7077 posts
4/23/2019 2:26 am

GAVIN, the fact is you cannot physically see most concepts but you can see love in many ways. World events however seem to make God less evident in this day and age.


GavinLS2 69M
1525 posts
4/23/2019 4:46 am

TY folks who have responded so far. I probably should have added that God cannot be experienced with any of our 5 physical senses. Nonetheless I am of the opinion that we can "feel" him within our hearts and minds.

Further, we cannot scientifically "deduce" the existence of love, but very people deny it exists.

GBU all,

Gavin


GavinLS2 replies on 4/23/2019 4:53 am:
Correction: Very few people deny love exists.

GavinLS2 69M
1525 posts
4/23/2019 4:51 am

    Quoting Katie_au_lait:
    Air is largely invisible, since it is composed of molecules, oxygen, nitrogen, carbon dioxide, argon and water vapor when it is moving it has momentum and you feel the momentum transfer when it hits you in the form of a breeze. If you have a device that converts that force to a physical variable: a near frictionless fan, or a very light flap, or a windsock then you can measure the moving air with an observable variable.

    What is very observable, is that without air, nothing can live. That's an incontrovertable fact.

Hi Katie! TY for commenting.

I hope u take a glance at my post above wherein I discussed all 5 physical senses.

I'd also mention that there are some organisms that can live without air. Some even without oxygen. But you're right about most of them --They need access to air, or at least a source of oxygen.

GBU,

Gavin


GavinLS2 69M
1525 posts
4/23/2019 4:56 am

    Quoting MrsJoe:
    Or what about air?
Hi Joe and Mrsjoe!

I agree with your comment here, but I think that point has been made very often in the past. But TY for commenting, and especially because it demonstrated why I needed to add my comment about all 5 sense.

GBU,

Gavin


looklook 84M
3925 posts
4/23/2019 5:30 am

Yes Gavin, love does exist but it can't be seen, only felt.
Here below posted are the first four lines of my favorite song:
Quote The lonely mind in an empty room
When it gets lonelier
Her warm touch
Heats up my fever! Unquote


GavinLS2 replies on 4/23/2019 7:35 am:
Nice!

sparkleflit 76F
10271 posts
4/23/2019 9:22 am

The argument is not that God cannot be detected by our 5 senses, but by any of the many other scientific means of detection at our disposal. Like you said before, God is a concept, as is love. Love is an umbrella emotion ....a complex emotion that is dependent on our brains........You can get as hyperbolic and sentimental as you want, but what we call "Love" would not exist without our brains.

Love as a concept is different in every culture. I remember being confused when I I first encountered the English language, because it had only one word for such a complex idea and emotion......Other languages I had encountered before and after that initial introduction to English, have many words for Love. I always wondered about that.......There are certainly differences in the feelings we have towards our children, our "lovers" our spouses, our pets, nature, art, music, an idea ,god.....etc.....but in English, it's all put in the same pile.....love.


GavinLS2 replies on 4/24/2019 3:11 am:
You raise some very interesting points! TY for sharing them here!

Here are some more questions we might ponder:

Can love be scientifically detected?

And another question: Is love really different in each case, or is it not that the parameters of our expectations about our interactions and/or relationship with each beloved thing that is different?

I'm gonna try to find a definition of love that I first heard from Skariff, which is a quote by a famous author. Unfortunately I can't recall it specifically now as I'm writing this, nor the author. I liked it a lot tho. In general, it described love as an irresistable compulsion to watch and assist if possible, and take pleasure in the developing spirituality (not necessarily religious) and overall well being of the beloved item or person.

But here's a definition I came up with on my own a few years ago: "Love is the recognition and appreciation of something outside ourselves, such that we feel better about ourselves for the experience."

You've added some interesting things to consider to this convo. TY for sharing

Best wishes,

Gavin

TxJW15 81M

4/23/2019 9:49 pm

Does the devil & hate exist?


GavinLS2 replies on 4/24/2019 3:18 am:
Good questions!

Like I can't fully comprehend God, I just don't know how to fully define or describe the Devil.

Perhaps hate is the polar opposite of the same force we call love? Both emotions seem to demand equal amounts of our energies and concern. What do you think?

GBU,

Gavin

sparkleflit 76F
10271 posts
4/24/2019 9:31 am

Yes, love can be scientifically detected.The area of the brain that is stimulated when we feel love has been pin-pointed and there are scans that clearly show when there is activity in that area.........

"And another question: Is love really different in each case, or is it not that the parameters of our expectations about our interactions and/or relationship with each beloved thing that is different?"

What's the difference?......Emotions are a combination of feelings and thoughts.....We have named and defined and categorized our experiences...each culture has a slightly different set of categories and labels.

There is no fixed standard where Human emotions are concerned, we can only surmise......What one person calls love is not the same as another calls love.........We know there is pleasure involved.......Humans have been defining love for our whole history......We have created poems, songs and paintings.....and created thousands of allegorical gods to represent love....each of them different..........


GavinLS2 69M
1525 posts
4/24/2019 2:46 pm

    Quoting sparkleflit:
    Yes, love can be scientifically detected.The area of the brain that is stimulated when we feel love has been pin-pointed and there are scans that clearly show when there is activity in that area.........

    "And another question: Is love really different in each case, or is it not that the parameters of our expectations about our interactions and/or relationship with each beloved thing that is different?"

    What's the difference?......Emotions are a combination of feelings and thoughts.....We have named and defined and categorized our experiences...each culture has a slightly different set of categories and labels.

    There is no fixed standard where Human emotions are concerned, we can only surmise......What one person calls love is not the same as another calls love.........We know there is pleasure involved.......Humans have been defining love for our whole history......We have created poems, songs and paintings.....and created thousands of allegorical gods to represent love....each of them different..........
Interesting!

I can't say they've done brain scans, but there's a researcher I saw on television one time who seemed to be able to induce in subjects the sensation or vision (wearing blindfolds) of God by placing a strong magnet near and just above their right temple. His conclusion was that God is simply something created in the human mind by electromagnetic forces. Folks like me, as you'd probably expect, see this work as simply showing some physiological means by which God can be accessed.

But I have to admit that actual brain scans would be more convincing.

Aside from all of this, I confess that often in a state of intoxication, via alcohol or cannabis, I have felt very close to God. I can't say that proves much though. Just mentioned it as what some may consider an interesting tidbit.

Thanks for sharing and best wishes,

Gavin


TxJW15 81M

4/24/2019 5:16 pm

I think all four are figments of imagination with zero substance.

Faith is based solely on what an individual can imagine.
People are not born with it.
They are victims of their environment that defines who & what they are.

Free thinkers know what is & isn't And have no need to be hit over the head with the unbelievable every week. (not to mention paying someone to do it.)

Those who can not deal with reality must be led in some way. That is why controllers refer to them as sheep or a flock & instill fear along with guilt into the weak and paranoid who are willing to accept it.

Well you did ask what I thought about it. LOL

I would hate being compared to a sheep. I have raised them & they are very dumb. Their only purpose is to be one of a group. Where one sheep goes they all want to go. Open a gate & they refuse to go into a pen-----grab one ----- drag it through the gate----suddenly all of the others will stampede and run a guy over in their newfound haste to follow the lead through the gate into the pen.
Been there & it wasn't pretty. LOL
Party On!